[Jennifer Keenan]: Sorry, everybody, I was late. Okay, pursuant to Chapter 20 of the Acts of 2021, this meeting of the City of Medford Historical Commission will be conducted via remote means. Members of the public who wish to access the meeting may do so by using the Zoom link provided for in the agenda. No in-person attendance of members of the public will be permitted and public participation in any public hearing during this meeting shall be by remote means only. Okay, crisis averted, everybody got in. Okay, I'll start with our agenda. Peter Hedlund, hi, welcome, I see you're here. So we had you up first, so why don't we start with you? I think we're going to circle back on the Thomas Brooks Park. I'll let you take it from here.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Great, thanks, Jen. Hi, Ryan, and everybody else. Good to see everybody. So let's see if I share my screen.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Oh, hold on. I need to make you a host in order to share your screen.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: OK.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Hold on. Let me add you. Can I add you as a host? Oh, Ryan, only Ryan can do it because I'm not on as a host.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah, I'll get there. Hold on.
[Jennifer Keenan]: OK, sorry.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Where are you? There you are. Big co-host. All right, see if you can go forth. OK, let's see.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Yeah. OK, is that working? Yes. Great. OK. Yep. So thanks for having me back again, been thinking about this and happy to present the next round of ideas. So let's get rolling here. Okay. So just a quick recap, not as in-depth as last time, but was everybody on this call at the last meeting a month or two ago? Yeah. Okay, great. So the 2020 master plan, I was fortunate enough to lead that process. We came up with these nine different focus areas and areas to implement out of that plan. Here they are in picture form. You've checked off these first three boxes. Nicely done. You restored the wall, now called Pomp's Wall. You oversaw the archaeological dig at the estate, number 2, and repaired the Grove Street edge. It doesn't look like this anymore. I've been out to the site a number of times. We'll meet some neighbors when I'm out there. It's interesting. People are very protective about this park. They want to know what I'm doing out there with a camera and clipboard maybe. And then when I tell them I was involved with the master plan and we're not putting in something crazy here, but this is what we're doing. They fixed up the brick wall and the edge. The few people I've seen out there are really positive about the changes. This one woman, her husband, participated in the archaeological dig, so the people I've met are happy with the improvements. And then there were six more improvements out of the master plan, and numbers 4, 5, and 6, we have ideas for all three of those, crosswalks, accessibility, trail improvements, and signage, and we'll talk about those in a little bit here. This was the 2022 archaeological survey that resulted in the 2023 technical report. These are pictures, thanks to Ryan for sending those, of the dig itself, 23 test pits, 1635 post-contact artifacts and 64 pre-contact artifacts. In the process of the master plan, I was educated in the definition of those two terms, post-contact being after settlers arrived and pre-contact, meaning before settlers arrived. This pretty spectacular finding there of this large pottery shard, they weren't all spectacular like that. It's a pretty successful day. So these were the recommendations from the 2023 survey technical report. It's a long document. It's very interesting to read. PAL, the archeologists involved with that recommended that the commission proposed site protection and preservation measures. Those measures were specifically recommended for the high sensitivity area in and around the house site. In these areas, below-ground disturbances should be avoided and are kept at a minimum. and it's a pretty neat park because it's been preserved for so long. Okay, so this is the approximate house location. This is looking south on the existing footpath. You can see on the right side, the brick wall there. This is next to the site looking to the south and looking to the north. So there's not a lot there. You can see a couple of the pink flags left over from the test pits to the south. Vinca has taken over. Perhaps a remnant from, it's an old naturalized plant, and maybe it's left over from 150 years ago from the estate. And looking to the north, mostly second growth trees. There is a larger tree here, but it's probably not long for this world. Some more site photos. This is the north entrance. You see the nice job they did on this field stone wall and leaving, as per the master plan, leaving these breaks. So this would be the north entrance. And this is this approach from the south and from the field and on the wall in that area. There are openings as well. So this is the draft concept. This is evolved a bit from our last meeting and I'll walk you through that. And then we have a number of images and reference images and some visual visualizations to talk about. The concept centers on this history walk, and that's in this larger, thicker orange line here, which would be a primary path. Purpose of this path is to make the site accessible. I like projects, and this is a great project because you can do a number of things at the same time. Talked about them down here at the bottom, you can improve accessibility, you can identify the park and you can make history visible. Right now the parks not accessible at all. There's a curb, the entire length of Grove Street and no curb cuts in the parks not identified. People know more so that it's a park with the work you've been doing, but there's no sign that says, welcome to Thomas Brooks Park. Fascinating history that we've been learning about for the past couple of years, some of the neighbors know about, but most people probably don't. Although some people are more aware of the wall now called Pomp's Wall with the recent work that was done there. The history walk would The proposals to enter here across from Jackson road and curve up following that existing path, and then exit here across from ravine road on that walk. There would be a number of historic markers 3. One, just talking about Native American uses on this site. Also, the African American history on the site and the colonial American history on the site. So this kind of a palimpsest of history. And then this proposal has two new welcome signs, two welcome signs. So one here at this entrance and one to the north. at this entrance so you're able to access the park you understand what it is and then you can learn about this history. We'll also talk about some different ideas for the estate house site stabilization which is up in this location and we talked a little bit about the crosswalks. This proposal would have two new crosswalks. Right now there aren't any. These could either be at grade or they could be raised and also serve the function of a speed table. Right now there is one existing speed table or speed bump just asphalt down here and then two new as per the master plan accessible parking spaces. This would really just be paint on the existing road there and sidewalks to access the crosswalks. For the history walk on the upper right here, here's a view of where it'd be. The footpath already exists. It's just a dirt path, so taking advantage of what's there. The concept here would be an accessible path for slope and surfacing. We don't have a field survey there, but I think, we should be able to make this an accessible walkway. The max slip you can have is one in 20, so for every 20 feet you go out, you can go a maximum of one feet up. Just being out there and taking a look at this, I think that that's possible here. That walk would be connected to these 2 new crosswalks that we talked about here and new park welcome signage at the beginning and end or at each access point for this for for the walk here. So, this has changed a little bit from the last meeting, but. The two welcome signs, which we just talked about here, welcome to Thomas Brook Park. This is a good opportunity. This comment came up in the last meeting about it would be nice to educate people on how this park got here. It was part of a larger estate. It was given to the city with certain stipulations required that the city do. It would also identify this as town property. I think it's a useful thing to do. Then a series of historic markers. One interpreting and describing the Native American history in the site, also the African-American history on the site, and a new marker for what's now called Pomp's Wall, which would be pedestrian-oriented and face the path. and a marker to interpret or discuss the colonial American history of the site closer to the estate house site. So the Thomas Brooke Park welcome signs, there's a lot of material out there. This upper left map is the overall estate. The estate dates back to 1660. This is hand-drawn, and you can see in green here the outlines of the estate in 1860 at this Brooks Estate plant and all the different parcels. Now, our parcel is right here, this triangular, very sharp, piece of land here next to the railroad, which was in place at that time. On the upper right, this is the 1855 H.F. Walling plan. Thanks to the city and the historical commission for providing these for the master plan and informing the project here. You can see this is our site right here. This is identified Gorham Brooks, and this is the estate that in 1855 was taken down approximately five years later. And then the park was essentially preserved, frozen in time. Nothing much happened on it. It's also adjacent to the Boston and Lowell Railroad, constructed in 1835, one of the oldest railroad and an important transportation a corridor continually operating in Medford, and that Thomas Brooke Park welcome sign could discuss that aspect. And in 1924, this six-acre park was conveyed to the city. A lot to discuss there, but important. So for the Native American historic marker, why is that important? Well, it's important because it's a pretty sensitive site that's been frozen in time. The pre-contact Native American archeological site, it was deemed as high sensitivity. In the 2022 dig, which only went down a certain depth, 64 pre-contact artifacts were collected. Examples being chipping debris, pottery shards, and dating back to the middle to late woodlands period, so 2,000 to 450 years ago. This is also a great opportunity for a new marker for what's now called Pomp's Wall. These are great images. The upper left, the date's unknown, but you see the image of the wall from the road. Looks like the wall was whitewashed at that point, and then in 1899, a little bit more overgrowth taking over the wall there. And pretty cool, the wall is still standing and was just restored. This is the existing marker, what was then called the slave wall, facing the road. So kind of hard to see as a pedestrian, unless you're on that path and know it's there and you sneak around and read it and look at it. But the wall was constructed about 1760. The city is required to preserve and forever maintain this wall. And if anyone would ever give you a hard time about why you spent time fixing up and money fixing up the brick wall. Well, that's the reason why right there. It's in the in the. Plan that deeded this land over to the city that if the wall was ever taken down or not maintained the state technically has the right to take back the whole park and also perhaps. Talking about the important restoration that just happened and why it happened and renaming of the wall. And there's other aspects of history that could be discussed that Medford has a substantial African American history. That's also important. And then a third layer, so we have Native American, African American, and now colonial American with the Thomas Brooks house. The sign could interpret the history of this site. This is this great image of the house that shows the wall and shows the road, shows people on horseback, shows the big trees out in front and what the estate might have looked like then. In terms of the historic writings that were done, we know that there was the brick wall between the street and the driveway. This is the driveway for the house, which is essentially where this proposed historic walk would go. There were three big black walnuts in front. There are still a couple walnuts on site. We don't think any of these three original ones, but there's one, the older tree that I pointed out in the earlier image that I can show you on a plan. is a black walnut. House was taken down in 1860, and we talked about the artifacts. Over 1,600 post-contact artifacts were recovered from the recent dig. How do we have the charge to protection and preservation for this site? Also, interpretation we can think of. How do we do that? The concept here is to use cornerstones to mark the site. I had a good conversation with Suzanne Shuro, who is the lead for PAL, who did the archeological dig and was involved during the master plan. We talked about this and she's spoken with Ryan about it a little bit. Using cornerstones to mark the site and different options for stabilizing the surface. Okay, so at the last meeting we talked about a couple ideas, local ideas. This is at Robbins Farm Park in Arlington. It's a different site. It's up on a hill. It's grassy. It's not as historic of a house, but they marked the corners and it's a sort of a neat a place that also serves as a seat and is able to give people a sense of what was formerly there. They used to have a dog statue when the farmhouse was there and they recreated that. Then this is an example Ryan suggested. It's a great one. It's a great house site. The Governor went through a house in Charlestown. As I understand it, related to big dig work was heavily excavated and is in a very public area. And the house was interpreted, was marked, were the outlines of the house. These are foundation stones that were recovered in that dig. And there's a pretty extensive sign here that allows people to understand the history of the site here. Suzanne made the point that, well, first of all, we're in a concept design phase here. We're not going to build this tomorrow. We're thinking perhaps longer term. But she did make the point that you don't want to make a treasure map to this site. There are still important artifacts underground there. You have to be careful, and this is not in the middle of Medford, this is not in a grassy area on the top of a hill that's very visible, this is kind of a hidden area. I remember when I first started working in the Metro plan and was investigating the site with Jen and Ryan and others, And I was on my own, you know, you're like, okay, do I feel safe in here? And gradually coming back to the site more and more, I certainly do. But it's more hidden, there are less eyes on this site. So I think we have to be careful about how we mark and interpret this. And as Suzanne pointed out at the last image we saw, this one, her understanding, this was probably done after this archaeological site was thoroughly excavated, so taken to like a phase three excavation. So basically, not a lot left to find, if anything. There's a lot left to find here. So having said that, If we mark the corners, what do we do to stabilize the surface? You could make a really good argument to do absolutely nothing. Just leave it as it is. Leave these small trees, leave this ground cover, leave the vinca, and that's certainly a valid way to go. You could also plant something there. plant a natural ground cover, we talked about that a little bit at our last meeting, or you could put a different type of surfacing in there, maybe stone dust or something like that, that would be sort of surface level. If we wanted to plant something in there, it'd be great to have something native, the vinca, although it's naturalized, has been around for a couple hundred years at least, is not native, but a fern like this would be pretty neat. Eastern hay-scented fern, one to two feet tall. It's really a great deciduous fern. also acts as a ground cover. In this picture here, it thrives well in forests, which is in our wooded area. I think it would work pretty well. It spreads by rhizome, so it spreads by its roots, and it would kind of take over this area. So that's an idea. One to two feet tall, we could plant something lower. This is also a native plant, Gold Star. It's native, shade tolerant, gets a little bit of that floral component that we were thinking about at our last meeting, that also spreads with its roots, blooms for quite a long time late spring to the fall. But it would just be a little subtle hint of a floral component ground cover in here with these stones that could be sitting in the landscape and give a sense of where this estate was. For a more visible floral display, I think this would be kind of a cool idea. So lilacs are really part of New England's horticultural heritage. been around for hundreds of years. This picture on the upper right was taken at the Arnold Arboretum. They have a big Mother's Day. Has anybody been to that? It's really cool. You got to go, or maybe go the day after because it tends to be really crowded. But why lilacs? Okay, if you look at the Massachusetts MHC, Massachusetts Historical Commission, Form C. One of those was done for the wall and one was done for the park, and that was kind of a lead-in to the master plan. And a quote from that is, and they researched the history of the wall, and in the wall Form C, They found this historic quote describing the site that said, beside the street and between the ends of the drive was this brick wall constructed, Pops wall, and bordered with a row of lilacs. That'd be neat. Bring back the lilacs if we wanted to have something that was a little bit more colorful. They peek out over the wall. Lilacs are tough as nails. Now, here's what that might look like. This is the existing wall after the renovation from Grove Street and what that might look like. A subtle intervention, peeking out over the edge there. I think they do pretty well there. They're tough plants. This is South and Western exposure. It would also be nice to plant a low ground cover right here at the base of the wall just to hold the soil in place there. This is a second image, existing conditions of Pompe's Wall from, well, that shouldn't be from Grocery, this is from that existing path. A sense of what this would look like. I don't think the path would look exactly like this, but just to have a six or eight foot wide path there, we could think of a lot of different types of material for that. I think it would want to look pretty natural and there's some nice ways to do that. Then you'd be able to experience the lilacs from the path side as well. That's it. I'm happy to go back and look at anything or answer any questions.
[Jennifer Keenan]: It's so great. Thank you.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Can you, yeah, that's perfect. Go ahead, Jen.
[Jennifer Keenan]: What does everybody think? I'll start. I love the lilacs. I'm a huge fan. I love the idea of the gold flowers where the house site was. I personally would like to see some of the scrub trees cleaned out from the house site, but I understand there has to be a balance of not making it invitation only for digs. The thing that concerns me about the gold flowers is that, because there's so many leaves in there, I wouldn't want them to get covered. It would be really great if it was kind of this like bordered area that stayed protected somehow to show off that bloom of flowers. And I love that it could bloom, you know, for a long period of time.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Okay. So, and then Jen, were you saying the thing that concerns you about the ferns is that it would be too hidden?
[Jennifer Keenan]: No, I think that with the gold flowers, I'm concerned about leaves piling over it over the years and it not being cleaned. And then we planted these beautiful bursts of color, and then they get hidden from leaf drop every year. Because it wouldn't necessarily be cleaned in the spring.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: No, right.
[MCM00001614_SPEAKER_01]: How much do they spread? I mean, if they're supposed to delineate where the house was, I mean, just thinking in 10 years, will it be like, you know, Vinca version two?
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: you wouldn't be able to keep them right in that boundary. They would sort of kind of mark that site and then the edges, you know, they're wild things and we don't have a defined border. So you're right, they could go anywhere, right? And they do spread with their roots. And so that's what they would do, right?
[Jennifer Keenan]: Is there a way to do a natural border with the stones somehow like, Maybe it's two plants and there's an outer border and then the color on the inside is a way to try to keep it contained a little bit.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: And I had that. I actually had a version that showed that dashed around the edges, but It was interesting talking to Suzanne because I was after talking to her, I was in talking to Ryan a little bit. I was very sensitive about she's like, you know, you've only done a very superficial dig is is everybody on this call on the commission is. Yeah, and okay, is Dennis McDougall on the commission team?
[Jennifer Keenan]: He's our admin.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, Dennis is the next step. Okay. Because maybe I was being overly careful or whatever, but basically, Suzanne was like, you don't want to put a roadmap out there. You've only dug down a little bit. And if you've got these First of all, we don't know where the house exactly was. OK, that's this is an estimation of where it was. And if you make it really obvious and put these corner stones down and mark out the foundation lines and clear it out for everybody and it's in a hidden area that's not that visible from the street, she was really worried about it and worried that the Massachusetts. state historical group would be like, no way. Until this site is thoroughly exhausted, you wouldn't be able to do that. But I was thinking the same thing, Jen, and related to the other example that we saw. There's a couple of people with their hands up, but should I call them? No.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Doug, go ahead and then we'll go to Eleni.
[Doug Carr]: Go ahead first.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Okay.
[Kit Collins]: I do like the way this plant for the park has progressed, and I like the use of sort of local plants to kind of create different spaces. Like, I love the lilac wall. I like the ferns. But to Jen's comment about maintenance, and this is more just a general question that I have, like, you know, I think we're all concerned about just kind of letting everything grow over the yellow flowers getting covered up by leaves or other local plants. Could the city parks department, you know, just come in once a year and do some light maintenance? I mean, would that be a big stretch for them, just kind of cleaning up and making sure things don't get overgrown or hidden or just so the planting still kind of play a big role in sort of creating these different spaces within the park. I think that's an important feature to maintain.
[Jennifer Keenan]: I definitely think we could ask the DPW about that. And certainly we've talked to them. They go in there and they cut the grass in the field and whatnot. So I definitely think that, and this is not just us, right? There's been other parks projects throughout the city with the CPC money. And then there's this kind of, there's this piece of maintenance that has to happen that can't be used with CPC. And so I think this is, We have to find out and I think there's going to be a bigger conversation about just the city budget and then how do some of these maintenance things happen after CPC projects come into play because the CPC money cannot be used for maintenance. We've had the same conversation about the Brooks Estate, for example. So I feel like, yeah, we're gonna have to figure that out somehow with this city. I know there was also talk at one point, too, about a friends group with some neighbors. And then if maybe, for example, at Brooks Estates, we host spring cleanups, fall cleanups. So maybe there's something here to be said for a handful of neighbors. And you come out, and you clear out that area once a year or something like that. OK.
[Kit Collins]: Hey, that's my only question, but I'm really liking the way that this is coming together. And then, yeah, so well done.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Yeah, I mean, I think, I don't know, you guys let me know what you think, but my thought is that we shouldn't, we should make our decisions. And to some degree, I don't wanna worry about the maintenance, like we'll figure it out, but we shouldn't let that hinder our decisions, or maybe we should, I don't know, I'd be curious to hear what other people have to say. Doug, go ahead.
[Doug Carr]: I do. I do like the idea if the interest is there of kind of friends of the park group, you know, to try to encourage that kind of ownership and buy in, you know, along this park, I think. You can't force that obviously, but it'd be nice if the neighbors who feel ownership of this park would do more than would actually, like you said, go in there once a year and just help out a little bit because the city's always struggling with maintenance as we know. I think this is great development. I like a lot of what I see. I like the history walk idea because obviously, both ways, forward and backwards, whether you go from north to south or vice versa. I did have a quick question. I think there was a photo show in the beginning. I think it was the very north entrance, almost at the bridge, that it looked like it was a break in the wall. That's different than the north crosswalk, right?
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Right, yeah. So that image with the break in the wall is right here at Ravine Road. Yeah, and there are a number of breaks as you move your way up. There's one actually right here at the midpoint.
[Doug Carr]: So, Peter, remind me, we don't need to make every single point accessible. We're making accessible from the parking. Right. Right. But every single break in the wall does not need to be accessible. Is that correct?
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Right. You would. I mean, the goal here, which doesn't exist now, would be to provide an accessible route. So if, you know, is there a portion of the park that somebody say in a wheelchair, and I'm more sensitive to this when I blew out my ACL a number of years ago, and then was hopping around. I'm like, okay, I get it. I get why these accessibility rules are so important. But yeah, so the accessible route would be here. You could have accessible parking place, which is really just a signage because the road already exists, and then the sidewalk, and then this route here. Yeah, the whole park would not need to be accessible.
[Doug Carr]: I didn't think so, but I wanted to check because it's obviously, you know, we try to expand accessibility anywhere we can, obviously, wherever we can. And I think you're right. This is definitely not more than 120. I've walked that many times. There's just no way a lot of grading is going to be needed to make that accessible, I think.
[Jennifer Keenan]: And it's definitely the flattest area, like if you go up. further off this slide towards the railroad bridge. The path weaves in, it dips a lot, so this is the widest and flattest area for sure.
[Doug Carr]: And Peter, there's no upgrades needed or are there to do curb cuts along from the accessible sidewalk to the crosswalk?
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, so that's an interesting question. So say if we look at this, so that's the- We do. You were just talking about that break there. So that would be the northern connection. I think that's Ravine or Jackson, I'm confused. So there we see our curb. Now there's two ways to do this. You can, what's typically done, drop the curb and have your striped walk and drop the curb on the other side as well, or you can have a speed table. Conceptually, speed tables are great because they do two things at once. They slow traffic down and cars, even with that little bump down there, cars fly down this thing.
[Jennifer Keenan]: That bump is useless.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Yeah. That bump is useless. But if there are striped pedestrian crosswalks, maybe some signage, that's done in a nice way. Just conceptually, it keeps pedestrians at the same grade. It's not like you have to go down to the realm of the cars and then back to the realm of the people. It gives preference to pedestrians, but it's probably helpful to have a conversation with your DPW before we finalize this, because if you have a speed table here, a raised crossing, then you have to deal with drainage. And you have drainage sloping down, I'm sure this road is curved, it's crowned, and The water runs against that curve and then it runs down this way. So if you create a speed table and there's a slope coming down to it, you need to have a drain to pick up that water. And sometimes it's not possible, it's not cost effective, but
[Doug Carr]: Understood. I'm pretty sure once we get beyond the conceptual stage, a meeting with the city DPW engineering would be in order, 100%. Two other quick questions. This is more for Jen and Ryan. The Pomswall name, is that official yet or is that just what everyone's calling it because they know what it's going to become?
[Adam Hurtubise]: It's not official yet.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Okay, yeah, definitely not official.
[Adam Hurtubise]: We're doing it out of respect for the 100.
[Doug Carr]: We've been calling it that for years because we know that's direction is going totally agree. Let's see. So, the slave wall marker. Is it's going to be removed, right? Because all the current, the new sign is proposed would replace it presumably. Right?
[Adam Hurtubise]: John Anderson said that the Historical Society is currently working on going through all of their plaques and debating on updating the signage with correct information. And if we so choose, he said that we can certainly take the lead on this one because this sign is especially wrong. They made a lot of assumptions and they didn't do any research to actually back it up. Um, so we could certainly mix the next that sign and reuse the reuse the stone if we still wanted to, but we could also do something else that certainly. You know, certainly I would not have as much text on that stone. Again, I would simply just have it say, Pomp's Wall, and maybe dedicate it to Pompeii and name maybe the enslaved people. Something small that can maybe be read from the sidewalk across the street, because that level of text is something that you'd see on an interpretive signage that Peter is proposing for the history walk, and that's where people are really going to do their reading if they do it at all.
[Doug Carr]: And it's facing the wrong way, and it's dangerous. And I mean, it's there's a million things wrong with that sign, obviously.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah, it's okay to mark the the, you know, it's nice to mark it as what it is. But basically, it needs to be able to be read from a car or bike or somebody passing by. And that's it, you know, so maybe it only says, you know, Pompeii's wall built circa 1760. And that's it, you know, in bigger text.
[Doug Carr]: Okay, just a couple more quick details, and I'm one of the other commission members that joined. Just two blocks away, there's the Sagamore John Memorial. Is there any attempt, you think, maybe when we do the signage on the Native American portion of the History Walk, that we try to link things together a little bit, or is that going a bridge too far, Ryan?
[Adam Hurtubise]: I have been told by Sue Anna Crawley that our number one goal should be to invite the native tribes and indigenous people to tell their own story and let them completely dictate what they want to tell on that interpretive panel. I 100% think that's the right thing to do.
[Doug Carr]: I'm with you there. Last question or comment was that we had talked about part of the story of this site is the transportation, the railroad, the nearby canal. That's not part of the history walk or maybe it can be. What does everyone think of that?
[Adam Hurtubise]: I'm just going to chime in. Peter, if we go back to that site plan, your site plan. Okay. Yeah. I think there's opportunity to engage the backside of the site and make a loop, you know, to connect that back path to your front path and accessible route and make the whole site kind of something so that, you know, if we do plantings that it's limited to that circular area inside of there, and, you know, then you can put an interpretive panel on the backside. There could be more that talks about the Middlesex Canal, the railroad, maybe even, more brooks family history because you're looking at at brooks playstead park at that point so um there's ample opportunity to add more additional signage more than just the three that we have you could add maybe another three and maybe that's you know maybe we do the front phase in phase one and the second phase in phase two but you know at least it's there and you know we could say here's the whole history of the site and then it almost forces people, if you want to learn the whole history, to loop around and therefore make the whole park safe because you've got people going in the back side. Thank you. That was my comment, was just to extend the history path all the way around the site and make a loop. Here, right. Yep. And for the backside, if there is a great issue, there's a six inch water main or drain main that runs down behind the whole house site and down that way that we, that the city didn't even know was there that we found during the archeological dig. So it's been disrupted already. So that will not be a grading. There will not be an issue. Okay. That's good to know. Yep. Yeah, it was, they asked us if we called dig safe and dig safe had no idea it was there either.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: So, okay.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: And that the thanks for bringing that question up Doug because I thought there was a great comment last time and I had envisioned the transportation story on the welcome sign, but at a certain point. You get a lot of information to put on this welcome sign. Welcome to the park, these kinds of things. And why does the park exist? And then it is kind of neat when you're in this park. I love trains and the train zooms by and to have an opportunity to be able to go back here, I think might be interesting. I would like to walk that again to convince myself that that's also flat. I think it probably would be actually.
[Jennifer Keenan]: I like that idea, Ryan, and I think too that, you know, when we heard from the neighborhood when we had our public meetings, you know, they're obviously, they're concerned about having too much touch, you know, stuff kind of changing in this park. But I think if we concentrate it in this area, and this is the spot where we do some creative planting, maybe some thinning of the scrub trees, and really make an effort to make this loop something special. And then it's all the more reason to leave the rest of the park almost as it is. You know, again, it's a minor cleanup of dead wood and whatnot. But it's like, here, we're just focusing on this area. We're not, for now, we're not doing anything down here in the green space. We're not touching the rest of the trails and the lean-to's and all that that the kids have enjoyed over the years. And just focus on this history loop. I think we can make a good argument that we heard them, and this is a nice kind of compromise for the history part and, you know, leaving the neighborhood and loving it the way it is.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah. So just so Peter knows, we did get money from CPC to do all of the curb cuts, all of the some sidewalks, the city engineer and traffic people said they certainly wouldn't put the sidewalks at every street but at important crossing locations. I think these two are important and then they would maybe space them out every other street from here on out, just to make it safe. There would be a curb cut at every entrance, that there's enough money for that. There's enough money for the signage. Then there's money in there for tree trimming and tree replanting. Specifically, if there are older trees that have died along the roadside, we can certainly focus on this area and replant those right away and get those growing.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: That's, that's great and there was a gentleman on Jackson road I was talking to I think in this house I tend to park in front of this house. Nice guy and that was his his comment to is like, I really like the improvements here but. Now these big trees are more visible right and and there is some work that needs to be done that's often not cheap to be able to get somebody to do that and do it well but having the community. already what you've done has improved all these property values. If I lived in this neighborhood and all of a sudden you get this great field stone wall and this restored brick wall, it's positive steps for the community. To make people understand that that's what's going to happen because people are sensitive there. I think our interventions need to be careful and light touches. because people are protective about this. They want to see it improved, but I agree, Jen, that they're like, what are you going to do? They're protective because this is where they let their dogs go and they see it as their park.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Right 1 of the 1 of the things that we just discussed as part of the cemetery potential for master planning is is dogs and currently there are no rules for dogs, but. the cemetery is debating on what the level of people walking dogs in there will be in the future. And one of the things that I proposed was perhaps if the city is going to say and start to enforce the dog walking rules that there's a possibility that they take a portion of Placedead Park and turn it into a dog park for this side of Medford so that there's a place to go outside of the fells outside of maybe you know, Thomas Brooks Park as it becomes a history park, you know, so that we're thinking of all the users of these locations and so that we're giving them the amenities that if we take away something, we're giving it somewhere else so that everybody gets equal access. So.
[Jennifer Keenan]: I think too, I mean, as I've walked my dog in here and, you know, it's, you're really staying on the trails because if you try to, I mean, I know like, I wouldn't let my dog kind of run rampant just because you don't know what they're going to step in. And if they hit a stick or something, you don't want them to get caught. So I think, you know, I think in the future, if there were any sort of restriction on the inside of the loop, you know, maybe just some nice signage as we kindly request, you know, don't let your dogs kind of ramp run in here for all but out anywhere else. But again, I don't really see that the times I've been there and there've been other everyone's on the on the makeshift trails, right, right, the safest, right.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Peter, I have a question and you can certainly take some time to think about it. Is there any alternative to, so the city, one of the other city's responsibilities is, and maybe it's now partially shared with the MBTA, is that we're supposed to keep a fence along the MBTA. right away. MBTA has obviously repaired their fence to kind of keep their right away clean. Is there anything that's more attractive or better to put in that would like disguise it. I mean is there a black covered chain link that might be more durable that kind of disappears into the green background of the future.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: And that's something that I learned, or we all learned about the park, that the two stipulations in the deed were you gotta keep the wall, Pomp's Wall, up and standing, and you have to maintain a fence on the railroad, or else the Brooks Estate is allowed to technically take this back over, and I'm sure nobody knows about that, right? But yeah, there are, Because it's just Chainlink now, right?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Right. And the MBTA owns that and put that in?
[Adam Hurtubise]: So I think that there was a city fence. And then I think over time with people cutting through, with trees falling down on it, the MBTA has made repairs, but it's not a great well-built fence. And as more stuff falls on it, it's falling apart. So, you know, I would like to see something be a more permanent replacement in the future, especially if we're gonna pour money into this plan, you know, we might as well make the whole area attractive. Even if we just focus on this little area to start, we'll just eventually run the whole thing.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, there and I can come back with some suggestions, but yeah, there are definitely better alternatives that would. just not draw a lot of attention to itself, but be a nice divider. Fencing is expensive. This is a pretty long part, but I can come back with some examples of what that might be and maybe just a general cost per foot or whatever, linear foot.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah and I was you know to deter people from like cutting through it you know one of the things that we could do is maybe plant some things that are not crazy invasive like for example I have a chain link fence that I plant morning glories on Morning glory is not the type of plant that you would want to plant here because they go crazy, but it creates a green wall and a green wall of flowers. So, you know, it kind of dissuades people from trying to climb over the fence, cut through the fence, et cetera. So, you know, maybe we can think about that too. Like, maybe Ivy can climb up and over it or something.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Right. Yeah. Something with thorns. Yeah.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Roses. Yeah. Or even raspberry, you know, native plants like fruit plants like raspberries or blueberries. Yep.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Okay, I just want to Peter, I want to be respectful of your time since we've been chatting for an hour here.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: So yeah, that's fine.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Anybody else has any comments? Oh,
[MCM00001614_SPEAKER_01]: I guess I just have a question and it's really for the commission, which is how concerned are you about drawing too much attention to the house site?
[Adam Hurtubise]: I think I think if we were to do anything, once we recover the information on here, I think what I would suggest is almost cap and fill where you would put down some sort of protective barrier that, similar to how you would treat like a brownfield site, that it's tough and durable fabric, and then just grade over the top of it with, I don't know, maybe four inches of dirt, enough dirt that you can plant light plantings, that sort of thing, and then, And then that protects the site from a digger. If you're going to be digging, it's going to take somebody some significant effort. But I, you know, I honestly think as we continue to improve this site and improve the paths and all the amenities, I think, I honestly don't think the people will be the problem. I think they'll self-police. I mean, it does happen occasionally, but like the national parks and stuff, there's tens of thousands of acres there, and people don't go digging. So it's just a matter of commanding respect for the site. The more we pay attention to it, the more we share its history, the more people are going to respect the site and not do anything to it.
[MCM00001614_SPEAKER_01]: So I mean, if the belief is that it's already been excavated.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah. Yeah, or that we know what's there and somebody can imagine what's there and not have to dig into the ground, right? So we have some of the artifacts, you can see the type of things that have come out of the ground, so you don't have to, the thrill of going to get it there yourself is kind of gone, right? Because we know what you're gonna encounter. And it's very easy to tell people, Archaeology is a finite resource. Once you put your shovel in the ground and turn that soil over, that's it. It's done forever. And I think people get that. There's certainly the people who, even the laymen who are doing this sort of thing, understand that. But, you know, will it stop any sort of real criminal? It doesn't matter whether they do or don't. Somebody who really wants to get on the ground here would research the site and find it anyways.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: Question for you, Peter. For those cornerstones, did you show any kind of image? Conceptually, I I'm wondering, like, are they tall? Are they near the ground? What's your thought on those? Right. I think you showed something, but.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I didn't show anything specific, but I was thinking something like this. So it could serve as a general border marker. Also, these are rough on the edges and smooth on the top, about 18 inches tall. So if somebody was out there and wanted to stop and reflect or something, it could be a seat. So this was kind of the height and size that I was thinking.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I like the subtlety of your approach. I don't know. I don't know why I don't think this is good, but I was envisioning them as sort of like these vertical elements like yeah, but which I don't I don't I don't know if that's great or not, but I think it would require like the sign explanatory sign to to something, you know, so that people just see these stones on the ground. I think that's what there's a great opportunity to explain about the estate house and what this is. I mean, I think that you almost have to have the two components for it to be understood.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, right. And my thought was that that sign could be there. I was trying to connect the But before this concept of the loop came about, which is a pretty neat idea, so that might change this right here was my idea for the bird location for the. interpretive sign about the house site here. But if we're going to loop this around, maybe they don't all have to be tied on this linear walk. Maybe it can be over in here, right?
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I like the loop idea too. I think it gives a little bit more I mean, I also get the point about the people in the neighborhood just wanting it to be almost wild. They seem to appreciate that a lot. I think there's birders who go in there and stuff. I think that's what's good about the subtle approach because it doesn't really necessarily Um, well, I don't think that the site should be like quote unquote sanitized, you know, and turned into a, uh, just to, to go to the other extreme to, you know, turn into a Disneyland cartoon version of itself. You know, it, I think there's something, there is something kind of nice about the fact that it's kind of wilderness almost. Right.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I, the more I've been out there meeting you're running into some neighbors and looking at it that I mean, there were some interesting ideas at the last meeting about other that in Philadelphia. I think that Ben Franklin cited different ways to visualize how this house might be. But I think. I think subtle is the best approach here. It's almost like you come across this area. Well, why is this area cleared out? Why is this planting here? I always think about something from C.S. Lewis or whatever. Why are these foundation corners here? Here's a sign to interpret this, so you almost discover this area maybe.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: I like that. I like that approach as a kind of a general approach. Yeah.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Okay. Any other comments or thoughts? I appreciate the time here and all the feedback. You guys are good ideas. And let's see, take these and I think we get one more go around. I'll check in with Ryan or others and then come back and refine this a bit.
[Jennifer Keenan]: That sounds great. Thank you so much, Peter.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Okay. Thanks so much for your time. Good to see everybody.
[Jennifer Keenan]: All right. Have a good night. Thanks.
[MCM00001628_SPEAKER_14]: Okay. You too.
[Jennifer Keenan]: All right. Thanks everybody for your comments. That was great. Before we move on to our next agenda item, we do have an application that came in late. So I would just like for us to accept that. Ryan, did you send out a link by any chance on that?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Oops, no.
[Jennifer Keenan]: All right, then. You want to move on?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah, if you want to upload that stuff.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Yeah, OK, I'll do that.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Everybody while we talk about budget that is the season to expend the rest of the budget. So if folks think so, we have the Thomas Brooks Park project and I'm about to ask for a $1100 expenditure on Cross Street Cemetery. We. meaning the commission and the cemetery trustees were successful in getting $4,800 from the CPC small grant project. I was also awarded a $5,000 grant from Freedom's Way National Historic Area to conduct the cemetery stone assessment. That leaves a little bit of extra money needed to do some a field work in advance of doing the actual assessment because it impacts the assessment. So I'll be asking the commission to spend $1,100 to cover the remaining budget on that project with the understanding that Cemetery will start to budget to approach the CPC in the fall for the restoration dollars for the Cemetery. So we have, I don't know, probably $5,000 or so dollars left to spend on MHC Form Bs. Is there any area in the city that you guys can think of that needs to be addressed, or Doug, any upcoming CBC projects that might want to be looked at, that sort of thing? Peter, I saw your hand up.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: Well, a little bird told me that Tufts is looking at the hillside hardware. Okay.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: I can check and see if, um, I know there's an area form for, for that area.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Cause I found that, but, um, yeah, I can just ask, uh, John to prepare an MHC form B for that building.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: I don't know. You know, this, this is a rumor I heard. So I don't know.
[Adam Hurtubise]: No, that's good. I mean, that's, uh, it's good to know what, um, you know, that's a building in that area, you know, what Tufts is doing. So,
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: I think Tufts owns it now.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. No, that's been around for a while. Yeah.
[Doug Carr]: Have they owned it for a while, Peter? I don't know. I don't know.
[Kit Collins]: It just sold.
[Doug Carr]: Yeah, I don't remember them owning it because I used to know the guy who ran that shop.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: I don't know for sure that they own it, but the bird I heard it from, indicated that it was that way. So, I don't know. I can't vouch for my source, but I don't want to get them in trouble, in other words, but.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Well, it's the buildings on left to rock. That's that, you know, essentially. So.
[Adam Hurtubise]: anywhere else that we can think of.
[Doug Carr]: Ryan, did we ever get, I mean, years ago, we asked Tufts to put together something for them to spend their own money.
[Adam Hurtubise]: I don't think we got anything from them. Oh, we lost him.
[Doug Carr]: He's essentially on the area forum.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Obviously somebody in West Medford is working with the system.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Doug, you froze up mid-conversation.
[Doug Carr]: Sorry. We'd asked Tufts to put together an area form essentially for their campus because we know there's always new projects, new additions, everything. I don't think we ever got it, but I want them to spend their money to, not ours, not the city's, to get a proper assessment of their campus and the important buildings on that campus, which we'd have very little about, I believe right now.
[Adam Hurtubise]: I can ask whoever the community relations person is and we can see what they prepared. I mean, maybe it just makes sense that while we have some money that maybe we partner with them so they get more bang for their buck. I mean, I'm certainly willing to document some of the buildings, that is our responsibility of sorts, but every building, no, I don't think the city should be responsible for it.
[Doug Carr]: What about an area form just for the campus? Is that just too big?
[Adam Hurtubise]: I mean, there's a lot to document and there might be different areas, like you might separate the historic quadrangle up at the top from the certain areas of the campus. You know, that developed separately from Professor's Row, which developed separately from the outlying areas. Tufts. square for lack of a better term up at the where the brown and brew is if it's still there. That's kind of a separate commercial node. So I can I can certainly ask about that area of form for that whole for the whole campus and see what we get.
[Jennifer Keenan]: So Tufts did buy it last year for Hellaside Hardware. Yeah. 2022, the whole site got sold. Walnut Hill Properties, that's Tufts real estate office. Paid 1.7 million.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: Well, it's a prominent building, that's for sure. I mean, site, let's say. It'd be great if something nice could happen there, eventually.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah. I mean, that would be, it'd be kind of cool if they did like an adaptive reuse project. They maybe kept the original building and built something new on top of it. That'd be kind of neat.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, they could definitely add a floor or two on that building. That would be neat, but that's not the rumor I heard that was, the rumor I heard was demo.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Demo and start over.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Well, they just demoed those two houses up the hill.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah, that's, yeah.
[Jennifer Keenan]: The ones that they asked, we had to review.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Put the prefabs on.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, for housing with purportedly respectful design.
[Unidentified]: Yeah.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Oh, we already have, okay, so we already have the form for tonight's application, but we'll look at that next month. Okay, anything else on the budget?
[Adam Hurtubise]: No, not that I can think of. That was the big one. So, yeah. So we're just gonna ask, I think we're level budgeted. So we're just gonna ask to spend the same budget next year.
[Jennifer Keenan]: So, okay. I did just email around guys the application. It's for 27 all month. they want to do a full demo of the property.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Taking a look now.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Yeah. The house, they claim it's going to fall down tomorrow.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Famous last word. There's a plan B, there's already a B on it.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Yeah, we already have it for this one, but because the application came in late, we'll do significance next month. So I just want to accept the application tonight.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: I want to look at the application.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: Is it that blue one?
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: They didn't say much, but they didn't plan to say much. Got enough of a site plan. Do we want to do a motion as to form?
[Jennifer Keenan]: Yeah, are you making a motion, Ed? Yes, as to form. Thank you. Is there a second?
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: Second.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Thank you, Peter. Okay, motion on the table to accept the application for demolition review for 27 Almont. Doug? Yes. Eleni. Yes. Peter.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Ryan. Yes. Ed.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yes, this is the form of the application, not the house.
[Jennifer Keenan]: And Kit. Yes. Okay, thanks, everybody. So we'll do significance next month for that.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: That was approved 6-0. 6-0.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Okay. Okay, Ryan, Cross Street Cemetery?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah, so as I explained, we need $1,100 to do some field work testing the foundations of the headstones to see what sort of way that they were anchored into the ground. So I need an $1,100 appropriation to complete that so that we can get that done.
[Jennifer Keenan]: So moved. Is there a second?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Second.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Okay, motion to approve $1,100 for Cross Seats Street Cemetery. That has been seconded. Doug?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Eleni? Yes. Peter?
[Kit Collins]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Ryan?
[Kit Collins]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Ed?
[Kit Collins]: Yep.
[Jennifer Keenan]: And Kit? Yes. Okay, thank you guys.
[Doug Carr]: Ryan, what does that leave us when we're at the end, you know, if we're getting close here on the budget?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Like 4,000 or so. enough, there could be extra money.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Well, are there any other forms like any?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah, there's time take the next 30 days, look around your neighborhoods, look around the community. If you're driving on the bus, or taking the train and see a derelict looking building, bring it up to my attention.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Oh, well, we're going to have one for Greenleaf.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah, well, yeah, I mean, yeah, we have that building, so I make a motion to appropriate $500 for 82 Greenleaf, which is a fire damaged building that's going to come down, but we should. We still have to review a significance similar to what we looked at in. The building on Auburn Auburn.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: So moved.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Was that a second? That was that was a second. OK, OK, motion to spend $500 on form B for 82 Greenleaf. Doug, yes, Eleni.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yes, Peter, yes, Ryan, yes, Ed Greenlight.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Yes, Kit, yes. OK Peter, so that passes 6-0.
[MCM00001614_SPEAKER_01]: Do we have form B's for like summit or terrace?
[Adam Hurtubise]: There's an area form, but it's old. That's a nice tight and compact area. The consultants did the Hall Bradley estates down below, so we can certainly ask them if they want to do the nice compact one street neighborhood there if they are interested.
[MCM00001614_SPEAKER_01]: There is always construction up there and with the views, I could foresee somebody deciding, to take down some of those little bungalows, make something much bigger.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Yeah, that's a great idea, Kit.
[Adam Hurtubise]: It must have been impressive when the men's club that was at the end of that road burned down in the 80s. You must have been able to see it for miles.
[Jennifer Keenan]: OK, awesome. Does anybody else have any new business? OK, moving on to old business. I don't think we have any update on anything under demo delay. I haven't heard. OK, nothing from Sid on Wareham Street and Winchester. Nothing from that woman. No real updates on the permits. I did reach out to the new building commissioner. We traded a couple of emails. I'm going to try to either get him to come to our next meeting or I will go meet with him just to say I wanted to introduce ourselves and say hi and forge a new relationship. I did email, just so you guys know, I emailed the team at the building department today because we did get, there was a permit for the 82 Greenleaf property. And so I emailed them and I said, hey, you know, please have them fill out the demo paperwork. so that we can just move that along as fast as possible. I said, so anytime that there's a property that there's been a fire, please just advise the homeowners to file with us immediately so that we can get going to move them along as quickly as possible so that they can get going on their rebuild.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: To ask an absolutely silly question, because it's been raised in a different context, If I had the misfortune to be a well-insured owner of a property which looks like it's suffering that sort of fire damage, does our fee get folded into the insurance payout?
[Jennifer Keenan]: We don't charge a fee.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, we don't charge a fee.
[Jennifer Keenan]: The building department charges a fee for the permit, but we don't have it.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: All right. All right. All right. I thought there was a $500 fee for the demo delay application. Or am I wrong? No, they never got put in. Okay.
[Jennifer Keenan]: No. No, that we, no, not, we would like to go down that road, but I don't know. Okay.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: I didn't know, I didn't know, I, I, I, I didn't know that it had not been put in.
[Jennifer Keenan]: No, the only thing we're asking for now is for the applicant to pay for the legal ad.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: All right. And that, that, that would get, that, that presumably would get folded in because that's, that is a permitting expense.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Right, right. Yeah. Okay, so Ryan already went over Cross Street Cemetery, so we're good there with an update, right? Okay. Any survey project updates?
[Adam Hurtubise]: The consultant submitted a whole bunch of forms for Fulton Heights. I processed their invoice. They believe that they might be done by May, so that's good news for us. That project will be ahead of where I thought it was going to be, so that's good.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Great. Do we have Doug for Thomas Brooks Park? Do you know, did our second phase get approved?
[Adam Hurtubise]: So they approved the application for the, they approved the long application because I was there for the presentation and discussion, but we're waiting for them to go before city council. Is that right, Doug?
[Doug Carr]: I think that's correct. There's a meeting tomorrow. I'll check in on that.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Was there like a second batch of applications that had to go for approval?
[Doug Carr]: I don't think so.
[Jennifer Keenan]: I keep seeing social posts of like, here's all the projects and ours is not there.
[Doug Carr]: Let me check on that. I'll get back to you guys.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Okay, thanks.
[Doug Carr]: But they did, they did approve it. But they, I think they, Ryan, you and I were texting that night, and I think they were trying to get It took a small haircut because they wanted the city to do some tree work. And I said, okay, if you do that, you better hold up your end of the bargain. You're speaking for the DPW without asking them. So like, I think that's, they approved it, but it wasn't, it was less than what was requested, but enough to do what Ryan thought was critical.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there's money in there for the dig, for the signage, for the ADA cuts. And then there was a significant chunk of change in there for tree work. Certainly not all of it, but that's fine. And I think that that's important too. And I was fine with that. I mean, I think we said, I think that we told, we're told like 200,000 or something like that. But of course, you know, it's subject to a little adjustments and, you know, if the tree department says that they can't do it, maybe they'll go back to the full thing and just say, no, do it this round, let them do the whole park. One other thing, we were approached by the Islamic Cultural Center for a letter of support for upcoming grant. And my chief concern is, have they provided the CPC with any sort of study of that building or preservation plan or anything that was being required? Because I know that I saw the windows are being worked on. But I thought as a condition of funding that work, that they were going to provide CPC with a preservation plan. And I have not seen anything. So I'm hesitant as a commissioner to support any sort of grant if they're not fulfilling their obligations to the CPC.
[Doug Carr]: I'll ask Teresa. The meeting is tomorrow night. I'll talk to her beforehand. I have not seen anything, Ryan. But that doesn't mean that it didn't happen at an administrative level. Yeah.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Yeah, and they asked us for a letter, and I said, if you can send us information on the project, I can put you on the agenda, and then we can discuss doing a letter. But I can't just blanket you write a letter until we know what's going on with your project. Right.
[Doug Carr]: If you didn't ask for it, they would. Yeah.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Right. I mean, you know, we have been pretty adamant, I think, and CPC has been pretty adamant about making sure that there's plans in place before work just continues on willy-nilly. And, you know, when I saw the windows disappearing and being restored, that's fine. But, you know, I think it's important to know, you know, what's going on.
[Doug Carr]: When did you see the windows being worked on?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Oh, they've been in and out of the building now for since at least December. So if you walk by there, you can see some of them have been restored. So I don't know who's doing their work for them, but they're obviously paying somebody to do it. I don't know if they've requested any sort of reimbursement from CPC, but it would be good to know because I remember being at that meeting that it was conditional that for funding that preservation work that they first do a plan.
[Doug Carr]: Okay. I'll check tomorrow night.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Yeah. Okay. Does anybody have anything else before we approve meeting minutes?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Okay. Just a quick question. I guess I'll bring it up again. What's going on with the Brooks Estate? Anything good?
[Doug Carr]: Do you have an hour?
[Adam Hurtubise]: We can save it for next meeting.
[Doug Carr]: President search is ongoing.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yep.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Please, Lord, ask your network. It is like crickets out there.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Well, I mean, you can start telling people that by stepping up your game, if you guys don't get one president, you're about to have an entire presidents. right, because you all take on the work, so.
[Doug Carr]: Yeah, that's not the plan, but I appreciate the plan.
[Adam Hurtubise]: That might shame some people into stepping up their game and to try to get some friends.
[Doug Carr]: I'll just say this, one application requested a six-figure salary to go with the all-volunteer position of inbound president. I could not accommodate.
[MCM00001614_SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, is there any anything written about what you're looking for? Because I have a couple of it's on the website.
[Jennifer Keenan]: There's a whole post. It's been I've posted it everywhere. Maybe not everywhere if you haven't seen it. But yeah, it's on our website kit and let me know.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: Hey, Ryan, I got one question for you. Is there any update on the South Street?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yes, so South Street voted to move forward with going before City Council, and I promptly told them that they needed to speak with the Community Development Board. I'm not sure if Dennis is here still, but if he is, it would be great to know if they did come before the community development board to get their input and approval because that's a necessary step before they go to city council. They were supposed to go to city council tomorrow night, so I don't know if that's going to happen, but I haven't checked the agenda to see if it was on there. I do know that Chris Bader is on vacation this week, so last I checked they were not meeting. So it is certainly not looking good for the HTC, but that's just one step. Maybe over the next couple of months they'll improve, maybe with their focus is to get this before city council. So if they really are meeting tomorrow, maybe it'll be good. I unfortunately, given the nature of the agenda, do not think tomorrow night will be the best night to bring it up. But knowing the particular nature of the discussion that's about to be had, I think there'll be a lot of people that would be naturally opposed to something like that. So they're almost sending it for a death knell tomorrow if they approach it tomorrow. City Council. So Dennis said they didn't go before the CD board yet. So that will have to happen. That has to happen before they go to City Council in order to to completely get the process. Basically, the Community Development Board is our city planning board.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: So it's just that hasn't happened. So essentially, Not really much has happened since that last.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah, they want to move forward. They're trying to move forward. And I'm eager to help them keep going and just make sure that they're doing it right. Good for them. So I want them to keep going, but I also need to help them build the board.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Another question, because you circulated it last week, Ryan. I certainly have no issue on the antennas on the Saltonstall building. I imagine, I don't think we have anything to say, but I just want to make sure whether that's a consensus.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah, I mean, I didn't have any. I think we said what we were going to say for the building itself. I think the construction projects just kind of move right along. So, I don't have anything to say, and if nobody else does, I'll just send them back our comments.
[Kit Collins]: Yeah, I don't have any comments either.
[Adam Hurtubise]: It's very common to get those type of crappy, terrible things to review. But I mean, it's the nature of the review that triggers it. So I mean, sometimes we catch good ones. Like they never built the ginormous monopole next to 93 in Spot Pond because of opposition there. So sometimes it works. Sometimes the need for a super big cell tower versus historic preservation wins out. I will say in neighboring Stoneham, maybe it does concern us a little bit because it concerns us for traffic safety nature. The city of Stoneham is kind of putting up a fight for the demolition of the Stoneham Hospital for a planned 40B project. I don't know if they're going to be able to stop it because 40 B is usually pretty strong and I know that they don't meet their housing thresholds because of another project that's just started after nearly a decade of fighting with the town. So, uh. They may ask for, and we may be looped into comments when it concerns historic preservation. I mean, the site is kind of historic. I don't think the hospital is historic by any means, but you know, they may ask for comments and we may get the chance to because of the parkway, spot pond, etc. And if you haven't seen it on the other side of the city, the Malden Hospital is gone, so it's about to be replaced by a state-of-the-art mental health care facility and very low density for that site. And the city of Malden is getting back something like six or eight acres of land that will be permanently preserved as part of this project. So that's a win-win with Hallmark Health and the city of Malden. And we're right on the border of it. In fact, in the 50s, I don't know if people remember, If you were here then they changed the border of Medford and Malden to accommodate the hospital because the ER and maternity wing was originally in Medford and they had to record all the births in both Medford and Malden, even though you were in the Malden hospital. So they literally changed the border in that particular area. So there's quite literally a little cutout when you look at Google Maps.
[MCM00001614_SPEAKER_01]: But that makes it really hard for some people to get passports.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah. Yeah, I'm sure it does. I'm sure it does. I mean... Unbelievable.
[MCM00001614_SPEAKER_01]: Birthplace.
[Adam Hurtubise]: No man's land. Here be dragons.
[Doug Carr]: Right. The DMZ between Menford and Baldwin.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. That's why you get a birth certificate down in Dorchester.
[Adam Hurtubise]: You know, it's kind of nice that the hospital is finally doing something with that site. I was surprised that they, I know they tried to develop it into housing, but I'm surprised that, you know, somebody didn't try to go like a low density route there. But it's, you know, the fact that they're getting all that land as green space back after they build this nice little healthcare facility is kind of a nice tribute to what the site was previously used for.
[8Sqy8gyjolU_SPEAKER_08]: Is that on the Malden River there?
[Adam Hurtubise]: No, it's way high up in the highlands. If you, you know, the radio tower that you can see from, say, you're going up the Fells Way heading towards Fells Way, where it breaks from West and East. If you look up straight up there, there's the tower. And you could previously see the the Malden Hospital there. You can't see it now. So and you won't be able to see anything there because it's only going to be a low two story building that's being built there. So. Not only do you get the skyline back, but you get all the, you know. All that area.
[Jennifer Keenan]: So, okay, uh, Peter sent around the meeting minutes. If somebody wants to make a motion to approve the meeting minutes, so moved. Thank you, Ryan.
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Second. Second.
[Jennifer Keenan]: I'll take you, Doug. I heard you first. OK, motion to approve the meeting minutes from February 2024. Doug.
[MCM00001614_SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Eleni. Yes. Peter.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Ryan.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Ed.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yep.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Hit.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: OK, thank you, guys. Motion to adjourn.
[Adam Hurtubise]: So moved.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Second. Okay, motion to adjourn, 8.36 p.m. Doug?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yes, ma'am.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Elainey? Yes. Peter?
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Ryan?
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Ed?
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: And Kitts?
[MCM00001222_SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[Jennifer Keenan]: Thank you all. See you next time. Bye, everyone. Good night.
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